Indiana USAPL focusing on Raw Events

Awesome stuff. Im planning on competing. Highschool Raw is the way to go for me right now.

I think this is a great move for powerlifting

Great job on paying for the hs lifters membership that shows something

Glad to finally see someone that actually has the sport of powerlifting as their main interest and not their ego.

Raw lifting will be all the rage, for a couple of years. Then there will be the injuries, the masters lifters not competing any longer, the gear companies stopping their support. Then the pendulum will swing back.

Raw is the future.

Its spreading. Might as well hop on board.

okie doke. will be interesting to see the results of this experiment a year or 2 down the road.

No excuses! Just lift it!

I think this is what some foresaw happening when they argued against the equipped feds offering raw divisions. That some raw extremist would start to try to weed out equipped by actions such as this. I thought they were just being a little paranoid, but obviously I was wrong. If this is allowed to be a state chairs position on what he does with his primary meets, to virtually push out the equipped lifters in what is an equipped fed; I can see many feds that have recently allowed raw divisions backing up and re-thinking what might happen else where. I think this policy will be a disaster if the raw lifters want to be a welcome 'addition' to the equipped feds meets. The danger here is that if new raw division followers start to become a 'cancer' and try to destroy and take over their 'Host' federations, that the Feds will see the need to remove the "cancer" (in this case the raw division) from their format and not allow it at all. All I see happening with this is raw lifting killing itself on the big federation stage and being put back in the small 'all raw' federation stages it had before. The moral is if you want to be put in the spot light, don't bite the hand that is holding your light switch. This move really fuels the argument of all of those who were against the equipped feds offering divisions for raw. If the raw enthusiast want the keep the divisions, the USAPL (and any other equipped fed) had better step in and stop this.

I think this is simply a response to lifters voting with their $$$.

If you look at many meets in Indiana (and surrounding areas)over the past couple of years you will notice that the RAW lifters now outnumber equipped lifters in most meets. What these guys are doing is what it will take for the USAPL to grow in Indiana.

They still offer the equipped divisions but they have simply recognized the reality of what the lifters are doing (lifting RAW). CUDOS for the move to encourage more high school competitors. I know of at least two high school students that will welcome this move :-)

Are you really that afraid of raw lifting? Before you have the "healthy" equipped lifting excising the "cancerous" raw lifting, let's see how popular raw lifting becomes. Frankly, if raw lifting continues to grow at anywhere near the pace it has been growing, and membership in feds like the USAPL continues to benefit from the growth of raw, then some changes may be needed, but it certainly won't be excising the "cancer". I would say for now, chill out and lets see how things go with raw.

If raw is a cancer I am a cancerous cell!

"Cancer" is the unregulated growth of "something" that is harmful to the host. Looking back on the problems and splintering of competition/powerlifting that was caused by the unregulated "growth" (sorry: technology advancement) of gear, I think it is obvious that equipment is the cancer.

Powerlifting is starting to become "healthy" again now that it is killing the gear and more people are lifting raw and drug-free. Time to shed that denim and other dumb shit and just see who can lift more.

Raw is becoming hugely popular with us (AAU). For the World Bench, Deadlift and Pushpull; we are expecting > 350 lifters, of which approx. 70% will be raw.
I applaud the USAPL's move to include Raw.
Martin

I am not suprised. Most feds that offer raw are thriving because teh IPF is behind the times and does not offer it.

The IPF is helping others raw feds grow.

Sonny and I spoke on the phone as I am a full-time high school strength coach in Ft. Wayne, IN. We talked about what was best to get more high school kids involved in the sport itself as I see and deal with kids and sport coaches everyday. I think this movement will be good to get more of the kids and other coaches involved in a simple, but effective way to compete. I am all for powerlifting and getting more people involved in it as I came upon it by accident and the same with Jessica O'Donnell...
Sonny has my complete support and help as much as possible.

I take exception to the "master lifters going away!" About the only way I will go away is when they pry my cold dead fingers off the deadlift bar! We may not be able to "impress the ladies" any longer and most of us can't compete with you young dogs in our weight class, but by GOD we are out there on the platform and wonder if you young dogs can "still do it" when you are our age! I have made many friends in this sport and I want to see them continue to lift in the Masters! Some day you young pups will understand what it is all about - maybe!

As for the equipment, yeah, that can be a problem to the manufactures and as a radio host once said, "follow the money!"

There is room in this sport and on the platform for all of us, so just back off, put on your three bench shirts, take your drugs if that is what you are into and total your 3000 pounds. We will watch in awe and continue to just do "our thing!" and when you get our age, if your still around, our records may still be there for you to take a shot at!

Bill Lindsey
Roanoke, Virginia

I'm all for supporting high school kids, and think limited equipment rules is probably the way to go with them. Actually though most high school meets are unsanctioned to keep costs down.

But to say that "RAW" lifters outnumber the rest in the area is just plain false. Being the APF IL State Chair, I can tell you that most of the lifters use equipment, and they FAR outnumber the raw lifters.

If this guy wants to run his meet all raw, more power to him. If the lifters like that, they will come support his meets. If not, they will not. As others have said, lifters will vote with their feet. But let's be truthful, the vast majority of lifters in sanctioned meets use equipment, and it will remain that way for the forseeable future IMO.

Kutin, I've read your posts and I know how you feel about equipment and equipped lifting. I don't just lift equipped. Yeah, that's my preferred way to compete; especially as a 50-54 master (and open) lifter. I also compete raw. Mainly right now because I like what Eric Talmant has done with the Raw unity Meet concept. My caution is for the raw lifters not to 'turn on' the Bigger federations that have given them a high profile stage to be seen from, and alienate them to the point of losing their welcome status. I was a fan of the APF allowing raw divisions, while many were also against it. What I see happening in Indiana is a movement of basically an "in your face" to equiped lifting from inside the equipped fed. I see this as a quick way to wear out "raw's" welcome in the big equipped feds. Effectively reversing the progress in the exposure made recently for raw lifting. I'm not afraid of raw lifting hurting equipped lifting. I am afraid of 'raw or nothing' zealots killing raw by turning on big feds who offered them a welcome. My 1st analogy you didn't like about a cancer. A cancer is simply cells from inside a body that 'turn on' it's own body. I'll make another analogy (maybe you'll relate to this one better). If I invite you into my home to live, and soon you start to insult me and say you're better than me and exclude me from anything you do; how long do you think you'll stay welcome in my house. I think that analogy describes what I read here on the Indiana situation better.

You should remember, or keep in mind, that a lot of people in Raw are people who have lifted a very long time, and for any of a number of reasons don't want to use equipment anymore, or made that decision some years back. Or some that just want the option to not use equipment and have good competitions when they don't.

Raw is still fledgling; there is no danger of having no equipped competitions in the forseeable future. If anything there is greater danger of raw competitions being hard to find, but I believe that raw is here to stay.

There is every chance that raw and equipped can exist side by side on a permanent basis. As I said, let's see how things go as raw progresses.

We all need to be respectful of each other whether we are opem, Master or teen,or Junior lifter etc. That also applies to geared or non geared. There is room for all lifting. Many may want to cross over into raw lifting or stay geared or both. It is about choice, not about which type of lifting is better,or which group is stonger or who is right.Best wishes to all powerlifters,which ever way you choose to lift. Harriet Hall

I would like to lift in some USAPL meets. Can't though, because of a rule that says I can't wear my work shoes. What reason is there for this not being allowed? Is it safety? Is it to look good? I'm told, tennis shoes are okay. I would find that to be amazing. Thanks for any information that anyone might have. Too old to change now. Just like to get in a meet now and then. Ronald W. Jeffery

From the IPF rulebook:

Shoes or boots
Shoes or boots shall be worn.
(a) Shoes shall be taken to include only Sports Shoes / Sports Boots; W/L, P/L Boots or Deadlift Slippers. The above is referring to indoor sports e.g. wrestling/basketball. Hiking boots do not fall into this category.

As to the reason for the rule, I think it is a "dignity of the sport" thing, but since it doesn't say in the rules, that might be wrong. I agree that it is an unfortunate rule.

My shoes are steel toed, leather, work shoes. I could even shine em up. Anyone hiking in these things is gonna get tired, real quick. Thanks for your information. Ronald W. Jeffery

A comment further up the page said, when was powerlifting raw. I've been lifting since 1962. The power meets back then and through most of the sixties had no gear, except knee raps and they didn't come right away. There weren't any lifting suits of any kind except the olympic lifting suits. Most powerlifters wore shorts and a belt and on rare occasion, you would see someone with knee raps. The gear just grew and grew from there. Some of the tricks that I've seen, would make you laugh. Anything to get a little more weight to move. Ronald W. Jeffery

If the gear is available why not use it? I bet they play football with a leather helmet.

The question was "when was powerlifting raw?"mid sixties. I'll add, that's when you knew who was the strongest. There are many strong people, but with gear you can only tell who lifts the most, not who's the strongest. I'll take my "good ole days" anytime. I lift primarily in the ADAU, and I love it. It's lifting the way lifting should be. I'm not anonymous, I'm Ronald W. Jeffery, and proud of it.

I have read the post and figured since I caused the argument I would respond. First I have been Powerlifting since 1982 and I have seen a lot of changes. I used to lift in gear myself at one time. For my own personal reasons I don't use gear anymore. I DO NOT as State Chair oppose those wishing to use gear. We simply decide to have some meets that do not allow gear (Monsters of The Midwest) and have put a Raw division in every meet. Now if this has offended some I can only say "I am sorry", but lets be real, if you really want to find out who is the strongest lifter then you must take off the gear. I don't for a minute expect a lifter to go head to head on the national platform without gear when all others are using it. That is why we put on the Monsters of The Midwest, to get back to the "roots" of Powerlifting. Now maybe this makes me an "old fart" but so be it. Next let’s think about how we grow our sport. We must require new lifters and the best place to do this is at the High School level. In our area we have a lot of economically dis-advantaged kids and they can't afford to compete on the same level as others who have the latest gear. (I won’t even go into the potential for injury with gear) By mandating that the High School State meet be raw it puts the kids on a level playing field. Once these "kids" get a little older if they want to compete at the State or National level they can use all the gear they want. Now as State Chair I offer to anyone who wants to see "equipped" only meets in Indiana call me or email me. I will be happy to sign the sanction form for you so you can hold the meet. I do not want to discourage anyone who wants to promote, but so far all we have seen is words not action. One other thing I want to announce is that we have placed some requirements for those lifters wishing to set a new state record. We have decided to follow other states and require a lifter to fill out a State Record application form and have the 3 referees sign it. If the meet takes place outside Indiana then 2 of the 3 refs must be national level. This will insure the integrity of the records. This form can be downloaded at the official state website. www.usaplindiana.com
Joe Goodhew
USAPLIndiana State Chairman
jgoodhew@usaplindiana.com
765-744-6528

If you want to lift RAW--lift RAW. It's great if that's what you want to do,I lift equipped but I also only use single ply stuff. I am from the time when powerlifting was organized with only one federation--then two--which was also good as I was the state chairman for the APF even before the big steroid thing -no politics- equipment was not an issue--then--The USPF was dessimated because of stringent rules but they had structure and integrity. So if these guys want to run RAW meets and get some sort of structure in this state great we need that,but we also have to think about going back to our roots-only single ply equipped meets-morning weigh-ins equipment checks and qualified judges.Lifting with single ply stuff does (as it was originaly designed)keep injuries from happening and that is all I know,everybody knows that if you buy a bench shirt for x-amount of dollars and you bench 200 one day and 400 the day you put that on YOU ARE NOT LIFTING THE WEIGHT -ego city going on there,not real sure how we(lifters) are going to fix this,but starting from the beginning won't hurt.