Nationals by the Numbers

Not really a surpise. The USAPL has the best organization, network and IPF affiliation like it or not draws lifters. It is the true World org even though most of us are not fans.

The USPF numbers were surpsingly low but the location did not help.

Numbers are probably down because of the economy, gas prices and family responsibilities.

Also, 2007 NASA World Cup had 40 Powerlifters: 37/3. The 2008 NASA World Cup doesn't occur until next month.

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This may be a dumb question but, why isn't any of the 3 lift competitors in the junior, sub-master or masters categories considered, why only Open competitors? I know there are some very good powerlifters in the other classes other than open. For example, the USPF Masters Nationals, only the open class lifters are considered in your numbers, why not any of the other classes? It is a "Masters" Nationals event. So, for example, for someone that competed in the USPF Masters Nationals, should they have entered in both the Open division and Masters division? Some people entered multiple divisions, some of us can't afford to enter multiple divisions, and just enter the one that is our age group. Just curious, it was Masters Nationals not "Open" Nationals. Also it seems that the open lifters get more "credit" than a junior or masters level competitor. Is that true? I know several junior and masters competitors that total elite in their category but they don't seem to get any recognition for that, IMO. Just trying to understand things, Thanks.

it makes a case for consolidation. No need for all these feds. Just stretches the talent pool thin.

The numbers that were looked at were open competitors. One could do the same with subjuniors, submasters, and masters 5 lifters if they would like. This is about what's going on in the open class though. In theory, open class competitors at Nationals should be the best of the best.

A couple thoughts:

Omaha was not the greatest place hold APF Sr. Nats. How about somewhere on a coast (FL, CA, NC, etc.)? I mean- it would be cool to be able to do something after you bomb out, miss a PR, etc.- like go to the beach, do some saltwater fishing, etc.

While I don't think USAPL collegiate nationals were inlcuded in this tally, I think that the APF could do a better job of reaching out to collegiate team lifters. If you look at the college teams, it seems like they are almost exclusively aligned with the USAPL. True, some of these lifters cross over into APF meets. But I think the team liftng concept has not been pushed very hard. The APF Southeastern Intramurals was reall the only APF meet in my recollection that was even mostly team lifters. Also, I think that something as simple as a meet director calling/emailing one of the college clubs in the area to invite their lifters to come out could pay off. Just a naive thought....

JON... SHOW THE QUALIFYING MARKS FOR EACH FEDERATIONS NATIONALS!!!

SOME FEDERATIONS GET BY WITH OPEN INVITATIONALS MAKING IT MORE OF A MEET THAN A NATIONALS.

THIS LIST IS USELESS WITHOUT YOU SHOWING WHAT THE NATIONAL MEET MEANS!!!

SHOW QUALIFYING NUMBERS!!! SAY IF IT WAS OPEN INVITATION!!!

1. It has always been my opinion that NASA should have a single Nats for each category.

2. The AAU numbers will be big. Dunno about WNPF or IPA.

3. No squatting, but WABDL has huge BP/DL numbers.

4. It has always been my opinion that 100% RAW and ADAU should join forces. Probably with ADFPF. The AAU should get in on it too, with a combined team going to WDFPF Worlds.

Happer,

MAYBE YOU COULD GET THEM YOURSELF!!!!

With this being the inaugural Raw Nationals for the USAPL, I would consider the large turnout an anomaly in this era of high travel costs. There is a great amount of excitement going into this event that has sparked interest for a large number of lifters. Additionally, the folks in St. Louis have a great amount experience in hosting national meets. It should be a great time for all! It'll be interesting, especially considering there is no World event to qualify for, if the momentum continues next year. It is my hope that it does. I make it no secret; I prefer raw lifting!

There is only a handfull of federations that have qualifying totals for which lifters can receive an invite to lift in the open nationals. Off the top of my head; USAPL, APF and the AAPF are among the few which maintins a high standard for lifters to qualify for the grand event each year. In my state (and circle of peers), they prefer to lift in USAPL sanctioned meets. Some are just learning about another federation for which they agree they'd like to lift in. But, when they seek a more diverse competitive field, they'll always turn to the USAPL for a variety of reasons.

There are arguments to made on both sides of the issue for having qualifying totals. But, when considering how regional each of the nationals have become, is having those standards really a good idea? Look at the recently competed 100% RAW Nat's. Most of the lifters were from Nevada. There were only a couple from east of the Missisippi River. Incidently, 100% RAW does not have qualifying totals for lifters to receive invites/nominations to lift in the national meet.

What is on the tip of my tongue is something that would cause a great deal of controversy. So, I'll keep it to myself. But, in my opinion, most of the nationals reflect regional contests. And in this era of high travel expense and questions surrounding the credibility of the sport, why not go to a meet close to home? After all, for most, it is about having fun. Even those who do succeed in the USAPL and the APF have the added burden of being able to afford and arrange schedules to travel to a world meet if they qualify. Only the dedicated few take on challenges that great.

Jim

Maryland Powerlifting

Lift..., what else?

I thought the APF seniors this year was a AWESOME meet. Rick and Becca did a amazing job. And Omaha was a really cool city me and my dad had a good time, downtown Omaha was very nice lots of good food and fun bars ect. The venue was very nice and accommodating and the caliber of lifters was top notch it was fun to watch and compete in. So yea why it would of been cool in a beach town ect, Big Iron put on a great meet and really showcased the best parts of Omaha!

Big Iron GYm put on an awesome meet and you really missed out if you chose not to go. Right now I really hope the UPA emergeses as the top fed because they seem to have their stuff together.

BTW USAPL Mens open nationals was all the way in Killeen, Texas. My training partner bitched for weeks about the location. Many still showed up anyway.

The USPF Nationals was a Multi-National Powerlifting Championship. It included the Senior (Open) Nationals, Master Nationals, and Junior Nationals for men and women. It also included the Bench Nationals and Deadlift Nationals for all divisions: Open, Junior, and Master. I competed in the Open or Senior Nationals as well as the Master Nationals. If a Master is competitive with the Open division lifters then he or she should lift in the Open as well as Master division.

I think there is alot of info that could be gathered if we had the Master division numbers and the numbers from WABDL. I don't think the numbers are down, I think "open lifters" number are down. There are alot of divisions that cause alot fewer guys and gals to compete in the open division, why compete open if you can compete in Master, Junior, and Sub-Masters?

I know that the USAPL has well over three thousand lifters, and WABDL is right there as well, so again I don't think these number gives us a good over-all picture. There is alot of divisions and separation between us, but there is also alot of lifters who call this their sport.

George

George,

While there may be much to learn about the state of powerlifting by looking at other numbers, that's not the point of this article. It is to look at the state of our open nationals. In other words, the state of competition at the highest level.

A couple of your statements are actually somewhat telling to the situation in America. You suggest that some lifters no longer compete in the open class but go to an age division. This may reflect a mindset shift of lifters moving where they have a better shot at winning. It also reflects the proliferation of divisions that has occurred.

You also say that some top lifters lift in other than full powerlifting meets. This reflects a drop in the importance of full meets.

Three Words:

RAW UNITY CHAMPIONSHIPS

http://www.rawunitymeet.com

Eric Talmant
CITIUS,ALTIUS,FORTIUS

I expected to see a big number for USAPL and smaller numbers for all the other feds, but extent of the difference is really amazing and it shows how bad the factionalization has become. Are people leaving the APF in droves, or just not bothering to go to APF/AAPF national meets? Wouldn't it be great if we could learn to play nicely together?

LIfters at USAPL Nationals:

Collegiate- 348
Men's Masters- 128
Women's Masters- 47
High School Nationals- 300+ (got tired of counting)

What Eric said. :)

What Eric said. :)

Staff,

I know that now with the masters, teen, and juniors, people will more likely compete where they feel they can win or place high. Because of this I think the overall numbers of lifters competing is up, even if we are divided. Which shows that powerlifting is still attracting lifters, and that is a good thing.

George

could we not get rid of the jr. class and start masters a bit later in all feds? or am I out of line by asking this?

that alone would breed more comp at each meet.It could hurt the meet promoters pocket though and we need meet promoters and they do work hard and should make some cash.

and police and fire is great but why?????
now I can see a police and fire myl. nationals
but should not be a division at a POWERLIFTING CONTEST?

The whole Raw Unity Championships concept is very simple: it encourages a lifter to participate in their chosen federation's largest meet-whether that is nationals or worlds or whatever. If you do well and qualify for Raw Unity (qualifying totals can be found at http://www.rawunitymeet.com) then come and compete against others that have also done well in their federation's largest meet and really find out who the top competitors are under a single set of rules.

Good words, Eric, but how about RAW United Nationals, too? I know we're not a federation, but we had 85 entries, which would have put us near the top of the list.

Most people who've never been to a WABDL Worlds have no idea how highly attended that event is. I've been to three of their worlds and at each one they had over 500 people and over 800 entries (it's single lift so some people signed up from more than one event.) The show runs for six days and for over twelve hours a day. A powerlifting contest that runs over seventy hours! Thankfully, they usually have it in Reno or Las Vegas so you can gamble, go to buffets and see some shows between watching your friends compete.

There is nothing like the WABDL worlds. Lots of great lifters, and lots of great people who come to see the meet.

Last year I got to meet Odd Haugen who was deadlifting, I saw him standing around watching the bench press, and I said I know this guy, who is he? and then it dawned on me and I said are you Odd, and he said yea. We shot the crap for 30 mins or more. This kind of stuff happens all the time at the WABDL worlds.

One other thing, the disabled lifters are often the best show there is; I have seen disabled lifters show so much heart that it inspired everyone, even the best in the game. No body else puts disabled lifters on the same platform, and on the same day as open lifters, and I have seen Gus do it a couple of times. Gus has a deep love for the game and every lifter has his respect, and this is why the WABDL worlds is so big.

George

Although the USAPL is far from perfect and has room for improvement, I believe a majority of drug tested powerlifters realize that it is the best overall powerlifing organization in the USA. There are many good powerlifters and benchers in other organizations. However, most of the elite powerlifters are competing in the USAPL. (not all)

The USAPL's biggest criticism has always been that their judging is too strict. In my experience it is strict, but not overly strict. I'd rather have judging be a little too strict than the circus mentality I have seen over the last 5 to 8 years. IF the lift comes up, it is good. (and if you criticize you are a hater, etc.)

Eric
The key words here are FEDERATION and NATIONALS,
you are neither, remember, that was your choice.
Look at the list above, you are not on it, when you do get on it
maybe everyone one else that puts on an unsanctioned meet will too. One thing is for sure if nothing else is, your one meet a year, unsanctioned, is not the answer to the federation problems, how could it be, you don't even come into play AT ALL.

Eric is doing something good for powerlifting. I don't see the harm in trying to bring together all the best raw lifters to compete against each other.

That or we can all sit here and bitch and moan about raw vs. single vs. double for the 253,074,459,649,460th time.

The sport needs more unification. Props to Eric for doing something about it vs. bitching about it. By all accounts his first meet was a success. Look for it to build momentum and increase in lifters.

Marvin Gaye (like Freddy) is dead. The thrill is gone, ya dig it? Now relax - nobody here is slammin' the USAPL. And sign your name.

I have a couple of comments/questions:

1. If comparing only OPEN lifters than the RAW USAPL numbers you are quoting are too high (by a whole lot). As a comparison the ADFPF had about 67 lifters.

2. Eric, how do you manage the insurance issues at your unity meet if each governing body does not "sanction" the meet. Does 100% RAW assume that liability?

3. Only one WORLD body has a legitimate Drug tested RAW worlds and that is the WDFPF. As the USA affiliate, the ADFPF by-laws reflect the WDFPF rules regarding equipment (knee wraps etc...). As long as the ADFPF intends to be the affiliate to the WDFPF, it cannot compromise certain rules.

4. One thing the ADFPF nationals did that I think is a great thing. Even with all the different entries or teen, master etc....There was a medal given to the overall high class total regardless of division. Team entry was also free to try to encourage more team competition.

An email has been sent to meet director Harold Gaines to help clarify the number of actual open competitors at Raw Nationals. The roster has all competitors lifting open and some in a second division. However, the notation in the open column may mean something else.

If you look at the roster online. A non-shaded cell with the letter O indicates OPEN. If the cell is shaded with the number 0 that indicates something else.

Doesn't WABDL worlds have 3 year increments for each division and has all divisions at its worlds?

And at its regional or national events don't they take the first 3 in every weight class for worlds?

Does not sound hard at all to make it to WABDL worlds. Perhaps that is why its so big.

No, the age groups are like everyone else with a few exceptions. Teen 15-17, 18-19, Junior 20-25, Masters 1 40-46, Masters 2 47-53, Masters 3 54-60 and so on.

At regional meets and nationals the top three lifters in each class qualify, and yes this makes for alot of lifters being able to go to the worlds, which is a good thing. Most classes are full and there is some very good competition.

George