doesn't surprise me at all, elite's q&a and logs for powerlifting are turning into junk, a lot of guys giving advice that really shouldnt be.

Anonymous Trolls: Why dont you elaborate since you are so knowledgeable? As a matter of fact why dont you start your own Q&A and show us all how it is done?

Yeah, but you can't fault Dave for trying to build a business. Let's face it, powerlifting is an underground sport and today people are more concerned about overall fitness then getting insanely strong. We are a dying breed. If he were to sell only powerlifting stuff, I'll bet his revenue wouldn't be as good as it is now. Have to entertain a big audience.

Donnie is going the way of the total, rather than the sponsorship.

Wendler and Tate both used Denims, Wendler used canvas. Paul used canvas, and the Supertraining guys use titan.

There was some hoopla over the inzer shirt donnie used in the IPA meet.

I think the problem is that elitefts has created a team not of dominant and mind blowing powerlifters like before, but instead created a team of a bunch of personal trainers who can powerlift pretty good.

What are you, fucking retarded? That's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. That's like saying the Yankees don't have anyone... wtf?!?!?!

I will say this-

I seriously believe that it's because of Talmant. I know he does his own thing- and that's cool and whatntot... but no one else on that site uses sheiko, no one else is all over there with logs AND q&a, and no one else is prancing around, asking for metabolic typing and goofy shit like that.

I think the iron brothers section has something to do with it as well... but hey, they're all still friends, so whatever...

Very true, but you cant say that Schwab, Yard, and cartwright dont consistly do well in meets and be at top 3-5 of there classes each year

Come on guys, why can't we just take the news as it is and wish both parties the best in their endeavors? No need for speculation and create an environment for more trolls to cause a ruckus over gear manufacturers, powerlifting experience, or dumb bullshit like whose grandmother can outsquat whatever federation quarter squats! Donnie is a great athlete and I wish him the very best in what he chooses for his own direction. I am looking forward to him taking the bulls by the horn for the IPA in South Carolina. On the same note, I know some great athletes in EliteFTS and they don't just lift "pretty good", they're damn good powerlifters. And as far as the business aspect of EliteFTS changing, you know damn well that the dynamics of change just to keep up alone can either make or break a business, so if they choose to broaden their target, that's their choice! Please, just be supportive, not destructive.

I may be way off here, but here goes...when Dave started EFS, it was a "link" to Westside & the Westside style of training that anyone could get ahold of, westside style power racks, seminars, gear...safety squat bars, chains, etc. you could buy them all from Dave, Dave is (was)a westside member. When the logs first started, they were Dave, Bob, Jim, & a few others, but basically all westside guys...remember when everyone would ask, "what did you do at westside on this particular training day?"..."what did Chuck do today"...EFS evolved & went in a different direction, it is not strict 1997 westside anymore & there is going to be a section of the public that is not happy with that, I count myself in that, but it is none of my business, I still enjoy some of the articles, the equipment is top of the line & they provide timely service & top of the line power gear that arrives in 3 days. take it for what it is. if I am wrong, so be it, it is just my observation. To me in the beginning, 1998 or so, EFS was all Westside, you don't really see or hear that name much on there anymore.

Dave has done more for powerlifting than anyone. I don't see Inzer or Titan giving out info like Dave. Elite has the best customer service in the business.
Matt K, Schwab and Aiches are not dominant lifters?????

No Oxy Talmant still competes and does very well unlike yourself. So whatever Eric is doing I would follow because it works!

When EFS was a new company, they represented the ideas that really catered to the majority of powerlifters (albeit beginners or advanced lifters):

Fuck guru's.

Fuck weak people.

Take drugs, buy gear, train like a madman and compete all of the time to win.

When they were a new company they really opened up the sport and the ideas of Westside barbell to the greater population. I felt very compelled to send them my money whenever I made a powerlifting purchase.

Now, however, they keep their site more PC, regularly include articles and pieces created by guru's, and have branched into the commercial fitness and collegiate strength and conditioning world (more so than their interest in powerlifting).

Now, this isn't really surprising. Dave is doing what he needs to do to make money. We can complain all we want, but we'd probably do the same thing.

However, the hardcore and Westside-related reputation is what built EFS into the company it is today. If they never had the support of powerlifters the business wouldn't have been nearly as successful. With the transition from powerlifting to commercial fitness/collegiate sports comes a price; I no longer feel obligated to support EFS as a powerlifting company.

If I need something and EFS sells it for a good price, I'll buy it, but I will always look for better deals because, to me, EFS is just another vendor now.

It's sad, because when they were new they were a breath of fresh air. However, I don't think anybody can fault Dave for this. The same way that we can't fault others for not buying or supporting EFS anymore.

I don't think they have went away from powerlifting. They just added more types of training and sports. There is good that comes from other sports and training that can help powerlifting. I don't see any one else putting on the seminars and training sessions like EFS had this last weekend.
EFS is a great site. Nothing is for everyone. Just don't knock someone that has done nothing but good for the sport. Seems that powerlifters just degrade anything that is positive for this sport because they don't agree with one thing or another. It is no wonder people don't want to get involved with supporting this sport.

schwab, yard, kroc, bartley (before he got hurt), ano (before he got hurt), cartright, jackass, frey (just won upa nats), baily.... they are all some of the best pl'ers around. They all have won big shows or hold big records.

They have some up and comers like jo jordon and such as well, and there is nothing wrong with that. Its cool to see logs of people working their way to the top instead of already being there.

I think a lot of readers are still pissed people like the bjj girl and margin got sponsorships when they didn't. Also, i don't think a lot of people can stand talmant... he seems so off on that site, he really does not fit in.

What people are pissed at is that Talmant doesnt use gear anymore, so he doesnt advertise METAL. He lifts in RAW divisions, so he doesnt support METAL. He doesnt use any EFS equipment, so he obviously doesnt support their racks, and supplies. He doesnt use conjugate method, and advertises Scheiko so he cuts out their sales of the westside and similar products. On top of that, the only thing he strongly advocates is met. typing which is outside of EFS, so... WHAT MONEY DOES HE BRING IN TO BE WORTHY OF A SPONSORSHIP?!?!

At least the trainers, BJJ, and BMX riders are hitting audiences that wouldnt be coming to the site.

When the top lifter in the world walks away from a spnsorship, thats not good.

Uh, some of you all need to open your eyes and get past your own "I soooo hard core!" attitudes.

Eric Talmant is a really knowledgable guy and he's f-ing strong as hell. Look at his numbers and realize the guy is lifting like this raw at 165. He takes crap because he doesn't have a macho meathead attitude, even though he is highly knowledgable in several fields that highly benefit any athlete. Especially Powerlifters. It's pathetic that people are so short-sighted.

On second thought, keep bashing the guy. Maybe then everyone will believe Eric doesn't know what he's talking about. That way I can have an advantage because I'm not too hardcore to recognize someone else's expertise.

And as far as what he brings to EFS, how about customers? There always have been lots of people interested in Sheiko methods. If it was 2002 and you were interested in Sheiko, where would you go? Not EFS. Now EFS has a resident expert that is willing to answer your questions. So you come to the website and ask a couple questions, and while you're at it, you buy some stuff. It doesn't matter if he's raw, if he uses EFS equipment, or anything else. The point is he brings people to the website. And honestly, because he doesn't use gear, equipment, whatever else from EFS, it makes his "sponsorship" a pretty cheap investment. Worthy of a sponsorship? What sponsorship? The right to post on the EFS website?

HAHA

Eric is a solid Raw powerlifter, so far on an incredible pace with his deadlift. He is doing more as well with the Raw Unity meets also. I don't think anyone here is attacking Eric personally for you to get incredibly defensive. I think they are sharing their thoughts on his benefit to elitefts from a business standpoint. Whether they are correct or not, I have no idea.

What I do know is that Eric has gone far and beyond to help and entertain anyone who is interetsed in his methods. And from my understanding Elitefts wants a wide and distinct group of lifters and not one in the same, and Eric offers this. He genuinely offers his help to anyone and has provided more material for free and to the site than most have in the sponsorship panel with his translations on Sheiko's work alone.

Loosing one individual (Donnie Thompson) should not speak volumes on what a company is going through or what has happened. It's just a matter of one man, and powerlifting has never been about ONE man.

DOnny hasnt even been on the Q/A for years so essentially elite isnt really loosing much, he didnt benefit the q/a and they still sponsored him, that says elite went well over what they normally do

I think the crap Bartley used to write about Donnie was the theme behind his deparure. Bartley just made fun of him like a kid in a school yard. And he didnt like it, but EFS allowed it! That could not have sat well with him. Now he is the Top dog and EFS has arrogant jerkoffs left and right dropping advice like their the Top dogs. Come on now who's log do you look at and admire anymore?

It's not a couple comments about Eric Talmant that bother me. It's people who think if you're not banging your head on the bar and screaming before you lift then you're not serious and you don't know what you're talking about. Nobody came out and said that in this thread, but I see that attitude. So, my comment was to address that as well as the comments on Eric.

Well said Mike. As a side note, did you notice that on the cover of PLUSA some spotter / loader was caught yawning on camera while you were pulling?

Anyway, it is unfortuanate that Donnie has decided to split ways but people have to stick to what they value and I can undertsnad where both Dave and Donnie are coming from. Elite has done some branching out, but by all means remains grounded to its roots in powerlifting. I think that the branching out is a major positive for the sport. If not for Elite I probably would have never heard of Powerlifting and would still be toiling away at commerical gym hell with no focus at all. I know there are probably a lot of "washed up meatheads" that would love to train and compete that just have never been in the right environment to know what powerlifting is or how to go about it. The site, and it's "branching out" helps attract more people to the sport.

I am going to defend Eric Talmant; Eric has helped me before with training advice. Granted I am nobody in this sport, but I believe in what it right and from what is wrong. Eric is a good guy and he will do the same for anybody in the sport. Yes Eric is different, but you sometimes have to think outside the box once in a while.

I like EFS and will continue to buy from them. Open up a PLUSA and you can tell who are the biggest advertisers. EFS is probably the reason the mag actually has colored pages.

The only gripe i have with them is are the gurus on the Q & A. I wish they'd drop a few of them. I want to read about theories and crap that doesn't work in the real world I'll go to T-Mag.

Sorry to hear this. I can't really comment on the direction of EliteFts, I don't follow it enough. I guess things change regardless of the direction, when you grow. It is too bad though that they let go the top powerlifter in the world though. If I had to guess I'd say Donnie is going to push his All Time total even further away from any competitors though at his next meet.

elitefts has changed and in my opinion for the better...i use the resources there to become a better strength coach...if it weren't for dave and the way elitefts has changed over the years i would still be stuck doing the same old thing with my athletes...but they carry books and videos on subject matter i can't get elsewhere...as far as powerlifting goes...i don't think elitefts has helped my powerlifting career too much but hey there are a million resources on the net and other places to get powerlifting info.

guess he just wants to be in Inzer.. easy as that..

Took him long enough to figure it out, I can't blame him.

it seems that this whole decision has been blown out of proportion. donnie clearly states in this release that he has enjoyed being a sponsored athlete through elite. he says nothing negative about elite, only that he prefers to deal with powerlifting only versus covering a whole gamete of sports.

elite is a well run company who has customer service second to none- the bottom line is dave and his company would make little to no money if they marketed stricly to powerlifters- the big money in this industry comes from selling weightrooms, not a 3 board or a powerlifting belt. this is accomplished by involving different sports- hopefully by doing this other people will be exposed to powerlifting principles that can help them in their sport of choice.

one can't help but think that one of the reasons donnie quit elite stems from the comments made by bartley on his training logs. but then again, bartley is painfully uninteresting without his comments on "fatty" and stories of the past. he even mentions donnie off-topic all the time in his articles.

i wish elite and donnie the best of luck- his decision to vacate his sponsorship will not effect the future purchases i will make from elite.

Why do you All care one way or another? I'm sure that Donnie has a new sponcer, so he will be fine. And I'm sure elite doesn't need him he never keeps his log and he doesn't answer questions so its really no loss to there company!! who cares now there both happy!! Damn go train.

I didn't even realize he was sponsored by Elite. He doesn't keep a training log on their website. He doesn't participate in Q&A.

Isn't it a good thing Elite is branching out? The more non-powerlifters that visit their website, the more people that'll learn about powerlifting.

Plus, shouldn't strength and conditioning coaches know about getting strong? Most know about conditioning, but don't know jack about getting strong. Dave was smart to take powerlifting knowledge into that area.

I really wish Titan and Inzer had similar Q&A for their lifters. It'd be pretty cool. They both have a few guys that'll help out people online, but there's no official place to contact one of them.

I think that it is important to remember that a sponsorship is a relationship. All relationships
are meant to last for their own unique prescribed amount of time. Sometimes that time is very short, sometimes it is a very. This was the time to Donnie and EFTS to part ways, nothing more...

Yeah Jon why don't you have your Inzer lifters post Q&A?

Nothing like a good ol head bangin and screaming. And this is just my opinion, because it may work for some people, but I think Sheiko sucks compared to other powerlifting styles. You got Westside, Metal Militia, etc. etc. etc. and I think Sheiko is just a waste. I understand you might like Sheiko because your routine was alot like it in many ways. As far as Eric Talmant goes, I don't know him or anything so I can't say anything about that. I do know that he is a little soft for me. I appreciate the technical expertise in nutrition and everything, but he has the attitude of a fitness trainer and not a powerlifter. That's just my opinion, and I'm not saying any of this has anything to do with Donnie Thompson leaving.

I'm not surpriced from this at all. Donnie get +100 lbs more out from inzer than metal shirts. If you want to lift big you have to choose the best gear. It's sad but true nowadays... But Donnie is still strong as hell with or without gear!

Best of luck to Donnie...he will continue to do his thing as Elite will continue do their thing. Friendship is friendship and business is business...no harm.
Best of luck to ya!

I realize that the topic is about Donnie Thompson and EliteFts, but I'm wondering if you would care to elaborate on this statement. Are you saying that college and professional strength and conditioning coaches lack knowledge in strength training? If you are contending that strength coaches aren't that good in training powerlifters or Olympic lifters, I would have to agree. But training an athlete for a particular sport requires more than training to a one rep max. Even a sport like football, where strength is a big component, requires more than powerlifter-like strength to perform well.

Having a section for Inzer, Metal, and Titan sponsored lifters to answer equipment specific questions might be a nice feature. I'll think on your suggestion.

Maybe you could have a poll on it or something. I'm sure a lot of people would like to see that. Back on topic, who cares who is or isn't sponsored by someone. Elite has excellent customer service and that goes a long way in my book.

From what i have heard Eric is going to be lifting in the pro/am...Im sure hes gona be gear whoring to the max there

Donnie's statement couldn't have been said clearer or more respectfully. He's a pure powerlifter and EFS is going in a different (read: not bad) direction now. Give DT and EFS their due respect because they've both done a world of good for PL'ing.

Some of you have put forth the same tired, wasted BS that "garage" bands talk about regarding selling out. Dave is running a business, and reportedly a successful one, so give the man his due.

Also, I'll bet that Talmant outpulls many of you posting on this board ... I know he outpulls me. He has a solid plan that he sticks to ... some of you could learn a lot from him.

There are a lot of outdated things out there. University of Michigan is still using HIT principals. University of Maryland won't let players squat over 315 lbs because it's "not safe". They use 315 for reps to estimate 1RM.

Just look at the NFL combine where they use 225 for reps as a measure of upper body strength. Why does that matter? It's more about maximum force deployment and how quickly you can get to the maximum force.

They use the 40 to determine speed. How important is that really? Who runs 40 yards in a straight line on a football field? Acceleration in the first 5-10 yards is far more important. That's something you could really improve with strength training.

Also, just look at how much guys improve their NFL combine performance by going to top draft prep place. These guys have been lifting weights for years and training these football drills. If they were training that effectively, do you think they'd be able to improve so much in 6-8 weeks? The fact is the programs they were using in college sucked.

Peanut butter tastes good.

Squats are hard.

I like water.

This post and your posted contributed equally to the topic. Quit your ramblings.

I have personally interacted with big-time football coaches that don't know their ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to getting strong. Probably every strength coach in the industry has.

For example: There are fucking DI coaches using HIT (1 set isolation exercises, on machines, to failure, once every seven to ten days) to train football players, and have been for years and making big money. Running timed two mile runs to determine football conditioning. Doing machine hack squats for sets of twenty, drop sets, as the entire workout -- four times a week! I and other strength coaches could probably go on and on...

That being said, there are great strength coaches who are well versed in different ideas and run great programs and are constantly learning and improving. Elite putting some of the knowledge that powerlifting has garnered over the years can only be a good thing for these coaches.

you still squatting in that titan boss .

Help me to understand is everyone mad because elite fts.com sells more than just powerlifting stuff. i know if i had a store i would do the same thing if this is the reason, then i understand dave and jim love powerlifting but if this is there source of income im sure they dont want there wife and kids starving just to make a few people happy.

Okay Dr. Jackass, let me let you in on something-

a) I'm not Ox. I happen to be a part of East Coast Barbell and his gym, and I can say that the knowledge he passes on to young lifters and the next great generation of lifters (as myself), is undeniably priceless. He will be doing probably his last meet in August, where he plans to hit 2400+. So, if Talmant's "metabolic typing" and stupid shit that he clogs up elitefts.com with is so good, then let's see him total 2400, or finish his career out in the top 3 total of his weight class, EVER, eh?

Aside from that, I'll say this- Sheiko in itself is an interesting, yet useful template to go by. That by which it's based on is solid, in certain cases, yet very "archaic" as Louie would say. It's a typical BFS, western perdiodazation, progressive overload template. Nothing wrong with that, but look at the number of people who use Sheiko, and the number of people who follow the basic principles of the Westside template, and tell me who is stronger.

Out of the 50+ people I talk to on a regular basis in my gym, every comment about Talmant and what he does has been negative. These things are useless in the sport of powerlifting. If they worked, then why isn't everyone doing them? They have their purpose, I'm sure- but not in this sport. My point in saying this is that, yes- Dave has to run his business, and he's doing a damn good job at that... yet bringing in things that are non-familiar to your lifters can produce bad results- as it has in this case. I love the fact that Dave is succeeding in answering numerous types of questions in the training world- but need we remember that almost all of his athletes are powerlifters, not certified metabolic typing specialists. Sorry, but that's not what the site is based on.

I think Donnie is a great champion.. He has to be one of the nicest down to earth people you can meet...

Elitefts is where I go to pick up information, its a great site.

That is a great idea that way I can learn more of Brian Carrols training and equipment set-up secretes :)

I've actually started to incorporate many things that Eric Talmant does and I will say that I am stronger then ever. Eric is a smart man and is definetely a lot more down to earth then many of you closed minded folks like "TheNewOx08 or mr mean." Grow up you pussy and stop getting so nancy about people you don't even know at all.

TheNewOx8 butter cup let's see you total 2400! Keep in mind that Eric is 165lbs, and is a respected lifter raw or equipped. So stop hating on Mr. Talmant, and start listening to him, maybe you might just get stronger.

As soon as those archaic Eastern European powerlifters figure this out, maybe they can put up some good lifts!

Yeah, no kidding. Imagine how good Olech, Belyaev, Suslov, Freydun, Fedosienko, etc. would be if they just knew the 50+ guys at New Ox's gym! Then they could be strong!

Nah I have been in the Inzer Trex for a long time now..

I will tell you all the secretes that you want, but you can forget about any, i mean ANY SECRETS!!!!

You in da rage x still big bailey?

how bout them ace briefs brian

I was just thinking that very same thing.

Hey rich.. I wore them before I was Sponsored by IAD.. They are a decent brief, but way to foamy and wear out easily IMO..

Hanley, you are from Ireland right? Please send me an email at sngmaxson@charter.net

Im sure any Inzer lifter would happily answer any question about the gear. I know I get emails all the time and so does shawn frankl and rob luyando,

This is the real and ONLY Chris Ox Mason. I want to publically denounce the comments made by "the New(?)Ox8". Myself and the other owners of Eastcoast Barbell wish to afferm that we do not share the views of the newox8 posted on this and and other sites. We at ECB incourage different training styles and methodologies. I, Chris Ox Mason, respect Mr. Talmant as a lifter, teammate, and as a pioneer in the field. If any one has any questions on this or any other matter, please call me at 336-403-6101, email at oxmason@oxsportz.com

Ox

The previous comment(s) made regarding reasons for Donnie Thompson leaving elitefts.com and/or Eric Talmant were in no way, shape, or form affiliated with the beliefs/views of East Coast Barbell Club or Chris "Ox" Mason. The gym mentioned was not ECBB, and I apoligize for any confusion that may have lead to these assumptions/conclusions.

Sheiko sucks? what a load of rubbish at least 20 IPF world champions have trained this way, how many have westside or metal milia produced?

To the person who said it was a "western progressive overload" system and was "archaic" you should read about it, it is a not a western programme the intensity and volume is waved much differently.